Curse

I Hate Chips · Sep 15, 2010, 03:32 PM // 15:32

I've read all ur posts and my conclusion is (most tanks to: The Drunkard

), I need to get rid of the mesmer panic, replace it with a ER prot/heal for that bar I have:

Vekk:
1. ER
2. Aura of restoration
3. Protective spirit (yes its in my hero-setup now

)
4. Aegis
5. Spirit bond
6. Shield of absorbation
7. Jamei's gaze (replacement for Infuse health because I dont like that my vekkie loses half his hp O.o good/bad?
8. Life attunement ( I let him put this on himself and 1 or sometimes 2 others)

Master of Whispers:
1. AotL
2. Animate bone minions
3. Death Nova
4. Masochism
5.Convert hexes
6.Protective spirit (2 times in hero bars is bad?)
7.Aegis (to chain with vekkie)
8. Signet of lost souls

The SoS:
I need a new build set up for him...
because the resto skills seem to drain his energy
1.SoS
2.Splinter weapon
3.Ancestors rage
4.Spirit siphon
----
----
----
----

Please comment my new setup

and add missing slots....

kanuks · Sep 15, 2010, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Hate Chips

7. Jamei's gaze (replacement for Infuse health because I dont like that my vekkie loses half his hp O.o good/bad?

It's good but not necessarily because infuse makes Vekk lose half his health but because your other heroe's/henchies will insta-heal him to full health which means that the supposedly nrg-free Infuse Health is not so nrg free (The others AI being the one that spends the nrg).

The ER ele Hero bar i use is :

ER
Aegis
PS
SB
Optionnal (Usually SoA, Remove Hex, RoF or a condition removal)
Jamei's Gaze
Heal Others (Jamei's duplicate skill)
Aura of Restoration

As you can see, I don't use Life Attunement, imo it's a waste on a hero bar. It's good on a human bar though.

Specs are 16 nrg storage, 9 healing and 9 prot.

I rarely use it when using h/h but when i play heroway with a buddy we almost always use it.

I Hate Chips · Sep 15, 2010, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by kanuks

As you can see, I don't use Life Attunement, imo it's a waste on a hero bar. It's good on a human bar though.

Specs are 16 nrg storage, 9 healing and 9 prot.

At first why is it better at a human? I micro life attunement so there wouldnt be any difference with a human?

Second, why do u even use 16 energy storage, with 12+1+1 u get 28 extra energy with 16 u get 32 extra energy. is the 4 energy difference worth the -75 hp? bit a waste imo.

kanuks · Sep 15, 2010, 07:25 PM // 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Hate Chips

At first why is it better at a human? I micro life attunement so there wouldnt be any difference with a human?

Second, why do u even use 16 energy storage, with 12+1+1 u get 28 extra energy with 16 u get 32 extra energy. is the 4 energy difference worth the -75 hp? bit a waste imo.

Because humans ER eles maintain prot bond on 4 other players so they need as many enchants on themselves to get a better nrg return from ER.

16 energy storage isn't for more energy, it's for a longer ER duration.

I Hate Chips · Sep 15, 2010, 07:33 PM // 19:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by kanuks

16 energy storage isn't for more energy, it's for a longer ER duration.

aaah

that makes more sence, but imo the 2 seconds still isnt worth the -75. but that doesnt mattter, anyone has suggestion for the RT??? or just a whole different hero?

kanuks · Sep 15, 2010, 07:43 PM // 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Hate Chips

aaah

that makes more sence, but imo the 2 seconds still isnt worth the -75. but that doesnt mattter, anyone has suggestion for the RT??? or just a whole different hero?

Those 2.2 (+20% longer enchants weapon) seconds makes a huge difference imo. At 14 nrg storage the ER downtime is too big imo (A little more than 7 seconds). At 16 it's a little less than 5 seconds.

-75 health is really not a big deal at all. I always used sup runes on my heroes.

For the RT :

Splinter
Sos
Bloodsong
Ancestor's
Spirit Siphon
Mend body and Soul
Spirit Light
Protective was Kaolai

I used to use the curse that boost spirit's damage but realized that Heros barely even use it and never cast it on the proper targets. Now I use ancestor's rage.

I Hate Chips · Sep 15, 2010, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by kanuks

Those 2 seconds makes a huge difference imo. At 14 nrg storage the ER downtime is too big imo (A little more than 7 seconds). At 16 it's a little less than 5 seconds. -75 health is really not a big deal at all. I always used sup runes on my heroes.

For the RT :

Splinter
Sos
Bloodsong
Ancestor's
Spirit Siphon
Mend body and Soul
Spirit Light
Protective was Kaolai

I used to use the curse that boost spirit's damage but realized that Heros barely even use it and never cast it on the proper targets. Now I use ancestor's rage.

U got nothing else then Restoration Magic? because I tried that before but my hero has some trouble managing energy (see previous posts..)

kanuks · Sep 15, 2010, 07:48 PM // 19:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Hate Chips

U got nothing else then Restoration Magic? because I tried that before but my hero has some trouble managing energy (see previous posts..)

That hero has spare energy. I don't get how you can get energy troubles with him. Are you using a sup channeling rune?

Crassus Praetor · Sep 15, 2010, 07:52 PM // 19:52

Like I said, at least from looking at your screen shot it seems to be because of PwK meaning the Rt can't hold his weapon and gain the extra energy.

I've run this build and don't have energy problems so I don't know why yours would

kanuks · Sep 15, 2010, 07:58 PM // 19:58

That's not really extra energy... It's just +max energy. It doesn't give better energy management. Maybe he was fighting monsters with energy denial.

I Hate Chips · Sep 15, 2010, 08:15 PM // 20:15

Naah those enemies have no energy denial at all...
I have it all the time, I will try it out without PwK maybe that will work... will place hard rez/ Life?

kanuks · Sep 15, 2010, 08:33 PM // 20:33

Life wont help. Just like pwk it costs 10 energy and is cast even more often.

What about you keep testing it and realise it doesnt have energy problems at all?

Also you didn't answer my question, are you using a sup channelling rune?

Maybe your hero doesnt want to use spirit siphon when he needs to? Do you notice he doesn't use it when he's low on energy? If so, manually cast it a few times then he should use it more (That's something i have noticed with heroes, they seem to learn a little).

Is your hero on guard? I just don't get how you can get energy troubles because it's a a very energy efficient build. As I said, he has spare energy most of the times.

where is spirit siphon on the bar? Heroes prioritize their skills from left to right. Put them in the order I listed and it should go well (Spirit siphon before the heals).

Oh yeah and the krait mesmer does have energy denial, his elite.

I Hate Chips · Sep 15, 2010, 08:59 PM // 20:59

I only use minor runes on all my heroes, 600 hp ftw ....
will try out again, got rid of PwK and Painfull bond, got a suggestion to replace painfull bond with?

kanuks · Sep 15, 2010, 09:14 PM // 21:14

Why don't you go with sup runes exactly? Guild wars is very different than other games.

Would you rather have 75 more life or :

have Spirits with more life and deals more damage.

have ancestor's rage and splinter weapons deals more damage

have spirit siphon gives a better energy return

?

More life is only useful against big spikes. How many times have you been spiked for 500 damages in guild wars exactly?

Guild Wars is not a max life/max energy type of game. they both replenishes very well while in combat and they replenishes better the higher the attributes you use (energy management and healing skills are more powerful).

I seriously recommand you to keep pwk. It's just too good not to use it. Just think about it, at 13 resto, it gives 75 life to ALL party member, so there goes your oh so precious 75 life you're so scared to lose by using a sup rune.

I Hate Chips · Sep 15, 2010, 09:18 PM // 21:18

hmm but PwK gets me in energy trouble, will try out that superior runes daddy

Daesu · Sep 16, 2010, 03:01 PM // 15:01

With an ER, Mhenlo, and some restoration skills on my SoS rit, you should not have a problem with heals in most cases if you flag your heroes then pull. For AoE spikes, I have Life and PwK.

Heroes suck with spirit siphon because they tend to siphon from the same spirit so they get diminishing returns but it is better than nothing.

My SoS rit has these restoration skills:

FomF
Life
PwK
MB&L (great with SoS and Life around since with more spirits, more conditions that it removes per cast)

By the way, EOTN Mhenlo does not carry any condition removal skill so when your warrior is blinded, condition removal can be useful.

Whirl E Vic · Sep 16, 2010, 04:36 PM // 16:36

As a derv, I always bring Xandra with SoS. I use 2 different builds:

Both have:
Splinter
Sos
Bloodsong
Ancestor's
Spirit Siphon

For the last 3 skills-
Smite Variant:
SoH
Judges insight
Castigation Signet or Smite Hex or Smite Condition as needed

Paragon Variant:
Fall Back
Find their weakness (using this you can 1-hit spike annoying things)
Pick one more command shout that is useful for the area: GFTE!, cant touch this, stand your ground, etc. or bring a rez

You don't need to add healing on your SoS, an ER plus monk hench are plenty of defense.

I Hate Chips · Sep 16, 2010, 05:08 PM // 17:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whirl E Vic

Paragon Variant:
Fall Back
Find their weakness (using this you can 1-hit spike annoying things)
Pick one more command shout that is useful for the area: GFTE!, cant touch this, stand your ground, etc. or bring a rez

You don't need to add healing on your SoS, an ER plus monk hench are plenty of defense.

Meh I don't like secondary paragon,
Find their weakness is energy dead ftw
Fall back also not that amazing skill for heroes (imo

)

byteme! · Sep 17, 2010, 02:50 AM // 02:50

@OP - Your builds are fine. You may need to tweak things here and there depending on area though. All the suggestions made so far are good but by no means should your builds be static. Be flexible. Problem with this entire community is this...

No matter how good you think your build is or how well it is received by others someone will always give you negative feedback and/or suggest you make changes to your build. As far as I'm concerned this thread can go on for eternity and you're never ever going to get a consensus on your builds that everyone can agree with. A lot of the crap is really trivial. You need this, you don't need that, I always use this, heroes aren't good at that etc... Everyone assumes we all play the game the same damn way. Pity.

PS. Before you know it threads like this turn into a 2-3 man debate over who's suggestions/builds are better and subsequently the whole point of this thread will get lost. There are a few individuals who are infamous for this. Stick around long enough and you'll spot them.

Crassus Praetor · Sep 17, 2010, 10:20 AM // 10:20

I completely agree with the post above.

Flexibility does help a lot, I always like to put in "Can't touch this!" and/or Mirror of Disenchantment for EotN areas to help against crit defence and dinosaur touch skills